Arch Linux isn't an operating system. it's a Tamagotchi for IT nerds. You don't actually use your computer to do any real work. You just keep the OS alive. It is the life mission now because you refuse to go to therapy or let go that 20 years old Thinpad. You have to feed it `pacman -Syu` every day, massage its broken dependencies and pray the new kernel doesn't shatter your graphics drivers. It’s cute, but some of us actually need to open a python code or browser without checking a wiki first
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Andrew
Unknown parent • • •Stacklight
Unknown parent • • •Cristian Rasch 🇦🇷 🇺🇾
Unknown parent • • •Anna
in reply to Cristian Rasch 🇦🇷 🇺🇾 • • •Brinki
Unknown parent • • •Douglas Spencer
Unknown parent • • •I have long taught that there are (at least) two computers; the one you tinker with, and the one you use for actual productive work -- "Don't tinker with the production machine".
So I have Debian Stable on the servers, and on the main laptop, and on the travel laptop.
If I have a machine I put Arch on, I don't expect the installation to survive more than a few days because it's a machine to experiment on (although I'm just as happy experimenting on a non-prod Debian machine).
nixCraft 🐧
in reply to Douglas Spencer • • •François 🇺🇦
Unknown parent • • •Deckard
in reply to François 🇺🇦 • • •Yup, Mint is cool and it made is way to be the "go-to" Linux destribution for beginners. Its influence is so big that, unfortunately, those who use it are considered as "second-class" Linux users by those who have been using Linux (and other unfriendly distros) for a while. Some people behave like childs.
@nixCraft
Dellion 🦔
Unknown parent • • •Sven Jacobs
Unknown parent • • •Ember in the Pattern Buffer
in reply to Sven Jacobs • • •Hexorg
Unknown parent • • •Draken BlackKnight
Unknown parent • • •Jakub Klawiter
Unknown parent • • •samsoul75
Unknown parent • • •cid_terron
Unknown parent • • •Capitã Jack
Unknown parent • • •da_habakuk
Unknown parent • • •JaggyJeff
Unknown parent • • •PhilSalkie
in reply to JaggyJeff • • •@JaggyJeff
Give MX a try - I've found it to be "just the thing" for a lot of desktop and laptop installs.
mxlinux.org
JaggyJeff
in reply to PhilSalkie • • •lxskllr
Unknown parent • • •Federico Lazcano
Unknown parent • • •Debian since 2001.
Tried Mandrake, Red Hat, etc, but Debian remained as the best choice for desktop and servers.
Around 2003 Knoppix was my portable system, because I didn't own a laptop.
Later (2007) switched to Kubuntu for desktop, but debloating every new installation.
Nowadays Debian remains as the best choice for servers, and Proxmox for virtualization.
Artemis
Unknown parent • • •PerlPlayer
Unknown parent • • •Michael / マイケル 사자 🦁
Unknown parent • • •Fuchsiii~~~
Unknown parent • • •your auntifa liza 🇵🇷 🦛 🦦
Unknown parent • • •Ramou
Unknown parent • • •And the whole thing stays super stable for an Arch-based distro.
peripinkel
in reply to Ramou • • •Then I look over to my Arch Linux using friend, not having done her assignments for 3 hours because she was tweaking her experience. Or fixing it whenever it decided it did not want to go on anymore, missing a whole day of work spend on caring for arch.
It seems to be her hobby and she works enough to compensate for it, but still 😭
puretaste
Unknown parent • • •Mateusz 🏳️🌈
Unknown parent • • •I’ve noticed that people often confuse stability ( = doesn’t change) with reliability ( = doesn’t fail). These are two different software attributes.
From my experience having a stable system, like Ubuntu LTS, can leave you with stale bugs that were accepted and will never be fixed (I’m not going to say a word about Debian because I haven’t used it much). Personally, I choose reliability over stability, as I get irritated by bugs but I like new features. I suspect this is also the preference of majority of users.
OTOH, on rolling release distros you get bug fixes as quickly as any new features and as quickly as new bugs as well. The truth is that reliability doesn’t depend on the release model. It’s rather a matter of testing. Testing strategy may influence the release model yet it’s not a direct dependency.
Onno (VK6FLAB)
Unknown parent • • •26 years ago.
lists.debian.org/debian-sparc/…
Potato: SPARCstation ELC white line on console
lists.debian.org(--Q--)
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •アイアンハンドガンダム
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Domenico
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •I use Arch as my daily OS, I update once a week, I can't remember the last time I had to do anything manually, it works pretty reliably.
I used Debian for years before Arch, I switched because of KDE that was always out of date and I specifically choose Arch because I liked their wiki.
On my home server I still use Debian because I want to forget about it. They're different, but good in their own ways.
ottonafo 🇺🇦
in reply to Domenico • • •my daily driver for over a decade now, manual interventions have grown super rare.
Domenico
in reply to ottonafo 🇺🇦 • • •juju424
in reply to ottonafo 🇺🇦 • • •Same here. I don't know what people do with their system, if they got it broken so easily. Five years+ without a single "broken dependencies" issues.
stib
in reply to ottonafo 🇺🇦 • • •machete_Badger
in reply to Domenico • • •@domragusa Same, I was always on LTS distros because of the fear of the above post but it's been 5 years now and I've used and maintained it the same way I've did with any distro beforehand, zero issues.
That said, it's only my personal anecdote. I'm aware that Arch had major breaking transitions in the past, some headache points, and esoteric software / driver users + AUR heavy users may naturally have more issues from time to time so I don't discount those experiences.
Fully agree with your post 😀
Dr. Øhm
in reply to Domenico • • •@domragusa
me too. Using arch on Desktop since three years and also using that machine for work.
Yes, there are problems occasionally. But I hate it much more when I try to do some stuff on my Proxmox Server or Ubuntu laptop and it doesn’t work because of old packages delivered with apt.
@nixCraft
Chris1776
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •BlueHeaven
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •MyNameIsRichard
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •WTL
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Milo
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Yep. There's a reason why nobody uses Arch for servers or production workstations.
I use only one operating system at home, on my servers and at work: Debian Stable
Random Sapiens
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •HarryK61
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Ashley Cave
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •maybe I'm doing something wrong but I haven't had any notable issues with Arch...
I few problems like network crashes etc. that remedy with `sudo pacman -Syu`; also I once managed to lock myself out somehow typing my password, although that was likely a PEBKAC issue 😅
nanashi
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Darkmm (free 🇵🇸) 🏴🚩
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Droppie
in reply to Darkmm (free 🇵🇸) 🏴🚩 • • •Becky
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •bemmesr
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •I hear this sentiment a lot, but I don't get it. I've been using #ArchLinux as my daily driver for years now. Yes, it's true, I ‘feed it pacman -Syu’ every day, but that's really all I have to do — and honestly, if it was actually a big deal for me I would just automate this. I've never had to deal with broken dependencies, nor has a new kernel ever broken anything. There was one brief period were yay stopped working but I just reinstalled it, and it was fine.
Just to be fair, I don't do anything fancy with my computer — I pretty much just code and check my emails — so maybe if I were doing something more complicated then I would see problems. But used as a regular laptop I've found that Arch presents very few problems.
I've even been able to run a few games from #Steam in the past, without any issues, though I don't do that too often.
Maybe you have specific examples in mind?
𝖋𝖑𝖔𝖗𝖎𝖓 🇨🇦
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •सुरेन्द्र
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Christophe B.
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Michaël Parienti
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Debian stable for my servers.
Debian Sid for my laptop.
The Best of both worlds
Klaus Frank
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Ironically that's what using Ubuntu and Debian felt like before I switched to Arch. It always broke you never could just add some project from github as it required newer libraries. And when I run into software issues they almost always were fixed upstream 5 or 10 years ago.
But these days I'm at NixOS though.
OS Master
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Cloudbyte - Dressing Up
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Swore by Arch for years, loved the ABS and the AUR, but when I built a home server the maintenance started to become more and more tiresome.
Replaced it with Ubuntu Server LTS a few years ago and haven't looked back ever since.
I also replaced it on my desktop with Bazzite, as I use it mostly for gaming, and connect to the server over ssh for work.
your auntifa liza 🇵🇷 🦛 🦦
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •linrunner
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •All irony aside, you're exaggerating wildly when it comes to regressions. I've been using it for four years now on several clients and I was honestly surprised that it doesn't show more regressions than Ubuntu LTS (which I used for 15 years prior).
Still, Arch and its hyped derivatives have no place in the hands of beginners.
Ganondalf
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Deep Fried Owlbear
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •This feels needlessly antagonistic.
Maintaining Arch isn't that hard. I do it on my gamingPC without really even thinking about it. I am admittedly fairly technical, but it's not remotely as difficult or time consuming as you're describing it.
I understand that this is intended as a joke, but it just sorta comes off as mean spirited.
Ramnarayan Kalyanaraman
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •i needed a good laugh today
Will share this with my brother who keeps on about arch linux
薇欧拉_Official
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Emm Archlinux是不错的 你的观点也是正确的 绝望的是作为一个极客玩具，本应该被高技术人群使用，然而在中国，它马上与“嘉豪”文化深度绑定了（嘉豪：指中国有些人他自己本来不强，但通过招笑的行为强行把自己包装的很强，以满足虚荣心，从而引起嘲笑），现在是我这种正经用户有时会被称为“嘉豪”，而“嘉豪”的人却准备用它装自己很强。未来，如果这种情况不的以缓和，可能有大量计算机小白涌入Archlinux（哪些小白甚至连Ubuntu都没用过!!!），届时社区会面临巨大的压力，充斥着无意义的提问，而且我们这些正常用户也会受到攻击。我自己很担忧这种情况。我不确定这封帖子是否能被注意，只希望宣泄一下情绪。
注：“小白”：指新手
lbky
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Scotty Trees
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •doragasu
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Lenain
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •dcre
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •rebootl
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Arch Linux since 2012 on my main work machine. At the start there were some system changes which required manual intervention but really nothing since then. I only do a reinstall when I change hardware.
But for servers it's Debian, also home server and raspberry. 🍥 ❤
Juan Bits
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Lyons
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •dmaccari
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •🏳️⚧️ Chloé: ADhdSL 512Kb/s
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •(I'm an Arch user 😅 )
Victoria 🏳️⚧️
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Anthropy
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •hey man, there's no reason to make fun of each other, you don't need this, they don't need this.
it also deserves to note that SteamOS is based on Arch; it's a hugely popular distro that has arguably added a lot of Linux gamers to the Linux camp.
We're all in this together. No need to kick someone while they're down. it's just useless infighting in the end.
If Debian ends up in a bad place due to targeted hacks, wouldn't you get tired if people started suggesting Arch to you?
Distant Echoes
in reply to Anthropy • • •@anthropy
I daily drive arch for production and playing games, and my servers use debian because Debian just so happened to be what my first OCI vm used so I just kinda stuck with it. I'm confident I could use either for either
Kat S
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •And I say that as someone trying to switch to NetBSD.
maaneeack
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •SO
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Martin Thornton
Unknown parent • • •Nyla
Unknown parent • • •Marco
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Łukasz C. Jokiel
in reply to Jakub Klawiter • • •Jakub Klawiter
in reply to Łukasz C. Jokiel • • •@lukaszcjokiel
I saw KDE somewhere around 2004, and as we know, the most important is the first impression. 😉
@nixCraft
Xawery
Unknown parent • • •Łukasz C. Jokiel
in reply to Jakub Klawiter • • •@wariat Well, I saw it around this time on FreeBSD and... it was just as CDE on Solaris. It was OK, but fvwm2 was mich leaner on my 486DX2 66MHz. Then GNOME for years, but GNOME 3. So switched to KDE and the plasmoids were the king... KDE Neon gives you reasonable stable desktop, handles wine 32-bit for bogus retro apps (scope and EEPROM burners), handles both flatpacks and snaps, tooling for Atari ST with gcc and vasm... Themes that work, usefull desktop gadgets, Steam integration.
That is my 28th year with Linux on desktop 😀
Peter B.
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •Never used #Archlinux, but it has one of *THE BEST* knowledge bases out there, which I thank everyone who contributed to it:
wiki.archlinux.org/
ArchWiki
wiki.archlinux.orgAndrew "P.B." Graves
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •surely bazkie 👩🏼💻
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •toffo / sbd 🏳️⚧️
in reply to surely bazkie 👩🏼💻 • • •@bazkie actually... imo it has a bit of truth in it. its rolling, after all - it MAY break. was one of the reasons i (eventually) migrated to nixos (with lix) - seems more comfortable for me personally
i inderstand theres people who find arch good though
surely bazkie 👩🏼💻
in reply to toffo / sbd 🏳️⚧️ • • •@toffo well, non-rolling releases can also break on upgrade, sometimes quite catastrophically..
but mostly I just don't really like the arrogant vibe of the toot, especially the follow up one on how superior debian is
Hoehlenmensch
in reply to nixCraft 🐧 • • •rtdsx
Unknown parent • • •Lain
Unknown parent • • •